Cut the knot: learn to enjoy mathematics
A math books store at a unique math study site. Shopping at the store helps maintain the site. Thank you.
Learning Math Online
Sites for teachers
Sites for parents
Terms of use
Awards
Interactive Activities

CTK Exchange
CTK Wiki Math
CTK Insights - a blog
Math Help

III Millennium Olympiad

Games & Puzzles
What Is What
Arithmetic
Algebra
Geometry
Probability
Outline Mathematics
Make an Identity
Book Reviews
Stories for Young
Eye Opener
Analog Gadgets
Inventor's Paradox
Did you know?...
Proofs
Math as Language
Things Impossible
Visual Illusions
My Logo
Math Poll
Cut The Knot!
MSET99 Talk
Other Math sites
Front Page
Movie shortcuts
Personal info
Privacy Policy

Guest book
News sites

Recommend this site

Sites for parents

Education & Parenting

Manifesto  |  Bookstore  |  Contents  |  Amazon store  |  Term index  |  What changed?  |  Contact  |  Recommend
RSS Feed: Recent changes at CTK

Irrational number to an irrational power may be rational

This is an interesting problem. To solve it I should find two irrational numbers r and s such that rs is rational.

I am not sure I am able to do that. However, I am confident that the following argument does solve the problem.

As we know, 2 is irrational. In particular, 2 is real and also positive. Then 22 is also real. Which means that it is either rational or irrational.

If it's rational, the problem is solved with r = 2 and s = 2.

Assume 22 is irrational. Let r = 22 and s = 2. Then rs = (22)2 = 222 = 22 = 2. Which is clearly rational.

Either way, we have a pair of irrational numbers r and s such that rs is rational. Or do we? If we do, which is that?

(There's an interesting related problem.)

References

  1. T. Gowers (ed.), The Princeton Companion to Mathematics, Princeton University Press, 2008, p. 157

Copyright © 1996-2010 Alexander Bogomolny

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Subject:Irrational number to an irrational power may be rational
Date:Fri, 27 Jun 2003 18:18:19 -0400
From:Mario Bourgoin

Dear Professor Bogomolny,

In your web page:

http://www.cut-the-knot.org/do_you_know/irrat.shtml

titled "Irrational number to an irrational power may be rational" you seek an irrational number which when raised to an irrational power is rational. In your proof of existence, you raise the square root of 2 to the square root of 2, and ask whether it is rational or irrational. This is answered on page 216 of Herstein's "Topics in Algebra", 2nd edition where we learn that in 1934, Gelfond and Schneider both proved (independently) that if numbers a and b are both algebraic and b is irrational, then a to the b is transcendental. Since you no doubt knew this, there remains to ask why you didn't mention this in your statement.

Sincerely,

--Mario Bourgoin

Well, this is a hard question. I am not sure if that's all that remains to ask. Certainly, with some effort, more questions could be raised. The site is not a text book, but a miscellany. I do not work on it on a regular basis. In all likelihood, an average page appearance and contents are due as much to my mood at the time of writing as to my assumed knowledge of the subject. Thank you for bringing that up. As you see, pages have both a spacial and a temporal life of their own.

To make it clear, what Mario says implies that 22 is transcendental because 2 is algebraic: it's one of the roots of the polynomial equation x² - 1 = 0. Thus it is not rational and the first choice for r and s should be discarded.

Copyright © 1996-2010 Alexander Bogomolny

35679874Page copy protected against web site content infringement by Copyscape

Search:
Keywords:

Google
Web CTK